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Identifying unseen forces.


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Posted (edited)

 

I feel stupid asking from completely unknown people, but here i go.

 

Does anyone here know how to recognize these astral/spiritual beings? 

Know anything about these ones?

One that looks like a domovoi but is hairless. One that is a man dressed up in a suit, and wearing a magicians hat. One that is basically just a small black vortex consisting of straight lines.

Seen two of these in sleep paralyzis, except the domovoi one was in a dream, i dream a lot anyways, but that was distinguishably weird creature.

+ My spouse saw a row of pitch black hands grasping towards us, when she was waking up (we were in a hotel at that time), don't know if its her vision of the beings.

 

Some background ->

Been having a lot of bad luck, weird happenings, etc along the years, like constant loop where me and my spouse are stuck, lost a lot of friends and social interactions with many relatives have died too, also sudden death of 3 male relatives inside 1 year was strange occurance too - maybe these things are connected. You know, anything that has to do with common curse symptoms, we probably had it if you ask. A random person even attacked us on the street in a quiet little town, when we were walking - in weird psychotic way as if we were enemies in a video game. dogs tend to go mental too. as an extended "proof", we did once see a physical object being pushed by something invisible.

We have actually moved about 7 times in past 6 years, because there has always been problem with housing/neighbors/etc. just one part of it. Perhaps i have some sort of "counter-domovoi" following me that sucks out any luck with housing.

Shamanic healing we had done to us last summer... only seemed to make this worse, i lost some of my ability to go in sleep paralyzis to see these things, but it seems like they got even stronger grip around me. Well, i told the healer that I'm not sure if she can do it remotely, and i was worried if she only makes the malevolent force more angry, she seemed to take the issue too lightly anyways, claimed to have seen a lot of things, even removed a curse she claimed - but in the end was not ready to take any responsibility. I did warn her many times, why am I to suffer the consequences?

(We actually met that shamanic healer IRL, and talked for hours, even then i told her that if the healing is not done now, i don't think it will be complete - and i was right, although I now doubt that she would have been powerful enough to do it even there, but it was best opportunity).

I feel so frustrated that people need so much convincing to believe there was something going on, i'm looking for the right crowd to help me, someone who is not psychotic but does know these things exist. There seems to be something about mugworth causing weird psychological symptoms when burned as incense, on both of us (me and my spouse) not sure what's that about.

 

 

*As for myself i'm more a pagan in general, than a shaman, i'm not on any spesific path so to speak, i think a lot of pagan paths are similar, either polytheistic or animistic* 

 

Edited by FinWanderer
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On 5/13/2022 at 8:48 AM, FinWanderer said:

 

Does anyone here know how to recognize these astral/spiritual beings? 

Know anything about these ones?

One that looks like a domovoi but is hairless. One that is a man dressed up in a suit, and wearing a magicians hat. One that is basically just a small black vortex consisting of straight lines.

Seen two of these in sleep paralyzis, except the domovoi one was in a dream, i dream a lot anyways, but that was distinguishably weird creature.

+ My spouse saw a row of pitch black hands grasping towards us, when she was waking up (we were in a hotel at that time), don't know if its her vision of the beings.

 

First of all, welcome FinWanderer;

This site is a Maker site - a western shamanic tradition with its roots originating in Europe hundreds of years ago but worldwide now. 

Sometimes, I feel almost dull as a maker attempting to describe our take on things people from other traditions and practices describe from their experiences. And that's because in the maker tradition, we break everything down into its most basic energetic form. So for example the domovol - we would not treat such an entity, if we came across one based purely on what we've been told about them. Meaning, we would look at the domovol and basically see its energetic construct, what is causing that energy to take the form of a domovol? Well, it seems that your background in Norse history and paganism might be 'coloring' this energy and causing it to form in your awareness as a domovol. So what does that 'mean?' If you go back to that memory and feel for the emotions, feel for what else besides the imagery was there for you, basically deconstruct that memory and image if you can, you will get an insight to what it was and why you were interacting with it. So I feel that basically, a little bit of personal life history, a little bit of collective cultural history + something in you + something or some kind of energy that you encountered is how it might break down. The trick is to understand why that energy interacted with you in the way it did and that will teach you something about yourself and the energy you interacted with.  Sorry if it sounds so academic but understanding it all at this level will give you the freedom to choose what you want to do with it - work with it or walk away from it.

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, silenceseeker said:

First of all, welcome FinWanderer;

This site is a Maker site - a western shamanic tradition with its roots originating in Europe hundreds of years ago but worldwide now. 

Sometimes, I feel almost dull as a maker attempting to describe our take on things people from other traditions and practices describe from their experiences. And that's because in the maker tradition, we break everything down into its most basic energetic form. So for example the domovol - we would not treat such an entity, if we came across one based purely on what we've been told about them. Meaning, we would look at the domovol and basically see its energetic construct, what is causing that energy to take the form of a domovol? Well, it seems that your background in Norse history and paganism might be 'coloring' this energy and causing it to form in your awareness as a domovol. So what does that 'mean?' If you go back to that memory and feel for the emotions, feel for what else besides the imagery was there for you, basically deconstruct that memory and image if you can, you will get an insight to what it was and why you were interacting with it. So I feel that basically, a little bit of personal life history, a little bit of collective cultural history + something in you + something or some kind of energy that you encountered is how it might break down. The trick is to understand why that energy interacted with you in the way it did and that will teach you something about yourself and the energy you interacted with.  Sorry if it sounds so academic but understanding it all at this level will give you the freedom to choose what you want to do with it - work with it or walk away from it.

 

 

Hi, thanks for replying. I do understand, that this is a forum constructed by "maker" tradition.

However, tbh, I kind of wished to just encounter someone who is maybe more in tune with how I view these things, because it is easier to work from that context. Why did i come here then? well, a lot of different boards are too noisy and my problem would drown in a lot of stuff that is probably there just for the sake of someone's boredom.

The Domovoi thing was just one dream, i mentioned it because it popped in my mind... Perhaps psychologically (and spiritually) speaking something more specifically recurring could work. BUT, here is in my opinion a MAJOR thing that differs from what you said -> I did not know it was called a domovoi until i searched a lot and found depiction of a creature who had eyes like the one I saw, in norse paganism I don't think there is Domovoi which is more slavic thing. Of course i do know something of slavic creatures/magicks. But perhaps without my research i would have just called it "A gollum mixed with a gnome".  It is however possible if the dream was psychological, that in depths of my mind I had this Domovoi name for it.

The Domovoi itself was on the roof of my paternal grandparent's house, where as it was perhaps accusing my maternal grandmother of something. I don't remember correctly, and I feel kind of silly bringing this one specific aspect in too much. The thing's that I have seen  in sleep paralyzis are in a way more interesting, but of course dreams are too. There are just so many dreams with me. Just last night i saw one that was a continuation to another one i saw some months ago.

Tbh, i'm waiting for a reply from someone who is "as delusional" as I am from the common perspective :-D. I have to admit that it's hard to grasp what you mean by your advice, but it sort of reminds me of schema therapy which I do have a book of. I know as crazy as it sounds, that i do have actual spiritual beings or "curse beings" following me, yet, i am aware that i do have my own psychological issues as well, but I also believe them to be separate from it. I also have realized a lot of reasons for my psychological issues, although that realization has hardly freed me of them.

I hope that even with my more north-eastern view of things, I am allowed to stay, and look for someone to aid me in my "travels". English is obviously not my mother language, so if I write in weird manner, that's the reason.

*Checking in, I have seen Domovoi creature in Witcher video game some years earlier, but it did not exactly look like that one, the reason i call that specific creature hairless domovoi, is because that's what describes it the most*

Edited by FinWanderer
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Here is additional explanation (also a secondary, unnecessary one) why I think I personally could not solely work from Maker's perspective.

Perhaps what I am saying that regardless which one of us is right, that for me, it is hard to work from perspective of energy as is. Just like for me it is very hard to understand numbers or mathematics as is - for me both just mean "kind of like nothing". I'm sort of dull minded on the mathematical side of things.

 

So for me something either has to be this or that, so I can work with it - as if it was a painting or a poem, it would be harder to make universally understandable painting or poem by energy without specific persons, creatures ,or groups harnessing and using that energy for their purposes.

 

Just like it would be very difficult for me to go on a diet where calories are restricted, calories as an abstract context being restricted would for mean me "something is maybe somehow restricted" and I would deeply struggle with it. Hence it would be easier for me to go on a diet where I just skip eating something that has a lot of calories, like "Don't eat cheese for a month" that would restrict my intake of calories, but I had something concrete to play with :-D.

 

Purpose of explaining this is perhaps why some psychological methods are lost on me to some extent. I guess i'm almost semi-autistic in that manner, i'll just get confused if someone wishes me well, sends me prayers, or anything like that, especially if its the first thing they say, it causes me no joy. I'd preferably look for something to relate on, than someone just trying to vaguely cheer me up.

 

So there's that, Besides the fact that i personally do believe there is something actual working/haunting against me, but i know, that is commonly thought to be delusional even with, ehm, special groups of people.

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54 minutes ago, FinWanderer said:

 

So there's that, Besides the fact that i personally do believe there is something actual working/haunting against me, but i know, that is commonly thought to be delusional even with, ehm, special groups of people.

Hi FinWanderer,

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you are working with something purely psychological. I was sort of indirectly approaching that when you see things a(and I do believe you that it is something working/haunting against you), that it's important to be detached from your emotions so that you can more clearly see what you are dealing with. I guess i'm just trying to explain that makers usually won't talk in terms of the classic traits of entities as determined over time by different traditions, we try to look at each case as new and fresh without those filters of explanation. 

You are very welcome to participate here, another thing about makers is that each of us practices our own version of the tradition, there are no rules, just tools. We also have a maker/teacher that is from Finland who may be able to give you more insight. He may chime in on this thread.

So I want to assure you that I don't think  you are delusional at all. My intent was to hopefully point out that if you are able to see energy clearly, without detachment, - reading it at a level before it 'becomes' a domovol or whatever else, then you will be able to understand without outside guidance, exactly what you are dealing with, you will simply 'see' and 'know.' But of course, getting other's opinions and sharing is also very helpful and welcome too, we need that as humans.  And you are welcome to challenge us here, we're not easily offended. :)

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, silenceseeker said:

Hi FinWanderer,

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you are working with something purely psychological. I was sort of indirectly approaching that when you see things a(and I do believe you that it is something working/haunting against you), that it's important to be detached from your emotions so that you can more clearly see what you are dealing with. I guess i'm just trying to explain that makers usually won't talk in terms of the classic traits of entities as determined over time by different traditions, we try to look at each case as new and fresh without those filters of explanation. 

You are very welcome to participate here, another thing about makers is that each of us practices our own version of the tradition, there are no rules, just tools. We also have a maker/teacher that is from Finland who may be able to give you more insight. He may chime in on this thread.

So I want to assure you that I don't think  you are delusional at all. My intent was to hopefully point out that if you are able to see energy clearly, without detachment, - reading it at a level before it 'becomes' a domovol or whatever else, then you will be able to understand without outside guidance, exactly what you are dealing with, you will simply 'see' and 'know.' But of course, getting other's opinions and sharing is also very helpful and welcome too, we need that as humans.  And you are welcome to challenge us here, we're not easily offended. :)

 

 

It is not as much a challenge, as it's just my firm belief that the "energy" is something, or HAS to be something in order to deal with it. If you prefer your own way of interpreting things I have no reason to challenge that. On the contrary, I was trying to explain that I see no benefit in changing my view, I think that purposefully trying to adopt someone else's understanding of worldview would be quite counter intuitive. So in my perspective the "curse being" does certainly use energy, but in order to be able to use it - it has to be something specific first, just like I am operating this computer, and I am using energy I harvested from food to do so. But it would be in my opinion of no effect to state "Well energy is writing us a post on forum" we need to identify me on some concrete level to be able deal with me.

I take things quite literally, like I tried to explain :-D. So basically in my mind you are just saying that "Think about that 0 before it becomes a 1, but don't think of it as a 0 either" which IMO is just trying to reinvent bicycle, and for that reason, FOR ME at least, it is very important to have some sort of terminology - as I do believe something similar has existed in the past, and I do not need to reinvent it for this purpose. I could look it as an individual, and look at it's individual reasons but that's whole another story. Anyways, emotions would be the only way left to read the energy, if it did not posses ANY prior background research by someone else.

I guess most abstract of those visions is that vortex of black strings (straight black lines) that I saw in sleeping paralysis hovering above my spouse's ear as she slept. That's sort of ??? creature that would surely amuse those who follow maker's path, but even for such thing I'd look a name for as if having it's name gave me power. Just like mycologist identifies different species of mushroom and so forth the medicine man, and all of the different industries can benefit from those discoveries.

But, I do think it's cool that you don't think I'm delusional.

I suppose that I still want to address that I'm not here to "challenge" people, i understand that i might come off that way, it's just more that in the limited capability which can be done over internet forums, I am trying to represent myself at least somewhat "as is". and with that becomes that it would be easier to work with for example norse/slavic shamanism, than lets say a caribbean or native american tradition.

Edit: also I did not mean that I need instructions in finnish, even if some things might be more understandable that way, but sometimes it's easier to talk about your things in different language, in some odd way. Well at least i'd be hesitant to go ask help from Ylilauta (finnish equivalent of 4chan) even though i'm sure I'd gather many answers.

 

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6 minutes ago, silenceseeker said:

Thanks for explaining further, it's all good. I wish I was able to help you further with identifying those energies but my knowledge of forces outside this tradition is limited. 

Yep okay, I'll wait if someone can. I think what you originally instructed me to do is what I do, maybe even too much as it is. You know, thinking about my life, and possible reasons for whatever. I also sometimes write down what I think. (And I do have pretty intense skill of hindsight too) So I think I do something similar already. This thing has just been bothering me for years, not even sure how many, and it does seem that I need external help especially from someone who has further knowledge of spirits, entities, curses. 

I'm not saying that your tradition couldn't be otherwise used for my help, and I mean this is your forum, so I'm not here to mock it.

 

 

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Posted (edited)

 

SINCE, i was talking about dreams too earlier.

I'll just write this here as if it was a diary, concentrating on dreams (After burning mugworth and asking for guidance). Of course constantly journaling my dreams here would be just a pestilence for everyone.


Well third time we had few beers prior to burning Mugworth, so panic attack would not set in. Only symptom was for me some sort of light headedness and gf didn't get any symptoms. Not even on dreams the first night but I had a dream that was echoing another one I had some months earlier.

In the dream I was apparently buying and old wooden house, it was a big house amongst natural landscapes, it wasn't particularly fancy except there was this interesting indoor balcony thing where you could set up chairs/sofa and watch movies as if you were in a private concert. That balcony was in the living room but you had to go there crossing another room, which was one of the houses "dark sectors" in the past dream this dark sector was in the basement.

At least this time there was that dark sector upstairs as well. These sectors would be places where there just was, well basically dark, possibly haunted or other danger lurking around, but not shown.

Person in the dream who was selling the house, was an old woman. probably nothing special about that, since it's often old people who are selling houses rather than young ones.

It's interesting dream if nothing else. I see a lot of vivid dreams anyways, so it's hard to make out which ones are important, but sometimes me or my spouse do se dreams that more or less mimic future events. I'm usually unable to lucid dream thought, my lucid dreams tend to fall in pieces if i try to control the dream, it just shatters and i wake up. So in my case sleep paralysis are closest to lucid dreams.

SECOND night however was my spouse's turn to see dreams regarding this same matter, she saw a dream of building too, but it was more like the building's we have lived together in - it had many floors and apartments, we were coming back from somewhere (to that place) in the night, and in the corridors there were these dark sectors just like I saw, expect she described them of being "absence of space and materia which could not be even looked at". she tried to warn me about running in to those, dark spots, even though she could not see in to them.

She also saw a grey cat guarding/sleeping on her stuff (boxes of items), first she thought the cat as nuisance that would mess with her items, but when she came back the cat had just been sleeping there. Both of us saw a dog in our last nights dream, but they had no major roles other than being there.  Well in my dream the dog did eat a lot of dog's cookies and followed people to abandoned house in apocalypse, where there was zombies inside. But that was not connected to other dreams directly, so might be nonsense/something else.

Well considering animals she also saw marked sheeps , and noted that "it's that time of the year again" in the dream. I instantly saw psychological connection to those student people who come to the street wearing coveralls with patches. So probably nothing mystical about that side note. (Not sure if you they do this in other countries).

The second one would probably be clearer if she wrote it herself, but i just put this here up as a journal on this subject. 

 

 

Edited by FinWanderer
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  • 4 weeks later...

Fin, I'll be honest and say that I read your OP but skipped the replies to it.  lol upfront.  That said.  Yeah, I personally have much experience with sprits.  Look through the forum here for my series entitled 'The Girl on the Other Side of the Door'.  I posted three parts and then decided to stop because I'm collecting it and adding to it for my next book.  From a fellow Northern Pagan, ... yeah.  I know a little bit.  I'll try to check back here and reply.

-Varg

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  • 4 weeks later...

 

Current conclusion about my problem, some sort of "vampiric link" or several of those, somehow it also causes bad luck. Or just plain annoyance that it seems to feed off.

I have concluded many possible reasons for this, deciphering my dreams, and analyzing past situations.

It likes to cause me panic, or lethargy, symptoms of vampiric attack I suspect, but it also gains momentum for not letting me succeed. I don't know how it does that, but for example, my problem for years have been finding us and apartment where we can stay without problems, just last night I once again thought that I had found one, yeah we could have to move AGAIN, but this was very nearby, it was free, and the cost was affordable. Today "poof" it's gone, someone else got it,  similar case has happened many times.

No reason to explain further unless someone here knows what to do about it.

Sleep paralyzes are sometimes caused by this, or me battling it, but sometimes maybe just because of drinking beers and hot air.

Was this vampiric link the same thing that pushed that KYGO speaker to the floor?  I don't know there had been a death in that apartment as well.

I might have done something that draws these forces towards me, like occult rituals trying to see to the other side. But I do suspect that in many case, these are inflicted to me by other people, both by their willingness to do so, and just by being around them, like viruses. yeah I think that's it, viruses.

It does affect me like a computer virus.

Once again "Vampiric Link" is just my current term for it, not exactly sure how what all of these things are, maybe I should email Vargtid and discuss with him, it just causes me anxiety to do so. Maybe they cause it, who knows.

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Posted (edited)

 

Yeah and also, it's weird that both mine and my spouses dad's died inside 1 year, unexpectedly, both of different reasons. But both at the same age, and the calendar month was same, just 1 year between. So whatever it is it might have affected that. In between that time one of my mom's brothers died, and I do recall seeing a dream of him being interested in kabbalah before he died, even though he was not close to me, and probably not interested into that. But some sort of symbolism it seems to carry.

Don't know if my father's suicide is supposed to cause him any spiritual problems? there are probably many takes on that depending on thy religion.

Month of father's dying was February, 2020, and 2021.

Edited by FinWanderer
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